Commerce One + Endesa +X? - 500 Beiträge pro Seite

[buckweiser]

Heute:

Die spanische Endesa SA (WKN: 871028), die britische ScottishPower Plc und mindestens zehn weitere europäische Großversorger wollen einen gemeinsamen Online-Vertriebsverbund schaffen.

Hintergrund der Initiative ist die zunehmende Deregulierung der europäischen Energiemärkte, welche die Unternehmen zu drastischen Kostenreduktionen zwingt. Nach Angaben von ScottishPower fallen bei allen zwölf Gesellschaften zusammen gut 30 Mio. Euro an jährlichen Betriebskosten an. Außer Endesa und ScottishPower sind die französische Electricite de France SA, die deutsche RWE AG, die italienische ENI, die spanische Iberdrola SA, die belgische Electrabel SA,die schwedische Vattenfall AB, die niederländische Nuon NV sowie die britischen Unternehmen United Utilities Plc, Northern Electric Plc und National Grid Group Plc an dem Vorhaben beteiligt.

Die Endesa-Aktie verliert 1,29 Prozent und gibt auf 22,90 Euro ab.


20.2.2000:

Commerce One und Endesa mit Joint Venture.
Commerce One (Nasdaq: CMRC; WKN:924107). Commerce One und der spanische Energieversorger Endesa haben ein Joint Venture bekanntgegeben. Endesa wird mit 80 Prozent daran beteiligt sein, auch ist die Unternehmensberatung PricewaterhouseCoopers miteinbezogen. Das Gemeinschaftsunternehmen wird sich auf die Entwicklung von E-Commerce in Europa, Latein Amerika und Nord-Afrika konzentrieren. Das Unternehmen wird im Juni seine Tätigkeit aufnehmen, ebenfalls ist ein Börsengang in der zweiten Jahreshälfte geplant.

Welche Rolle wird CMRC spielen?

[DimStar]

Online-Vertriebsverbund wäre nicht procurement, sondern eben Verkauf. In der Meldung taucht aber auch was von den Betriebskosten auf. Dies hätte die Redaktion wiederum nicht verfasst, wenn es nicht doch um procurement ginge. Bestimmt mal wieder Schmieren-Journalismus. Moment, schauen wir mal nach original-Meldungen...

[DimStar]

habe kein original gefunden, aber es scheint wirklich um procurement zu gehen - unter Führung der Endesa. ich denke, das ist ein klarer Fall für CMRC - HUGE. Da haben wir eine Plattform, an der die europäische Energiewirtschaft nicht mehr vorbeikommt.

Strombranche: Europas Energieriesen wollen Online-Plattform gründen

Zwölf der größten europäischen Energieversorger wollen künftig über eine gemeinsame Online-Plattform ihren Einkauf abwickeln.

Das meldet die Nachrichtenagentur Reuters unter Berufung auf so genannte `Kreise` Danach versprechen sich die Energiefirmen große Einsparmöglichkeiten. Über die Plattform sollen Geschäfte im Wert von 22 Mrd. Euro abgewickelt werden. Nach Angaben von Reuters wird die Partnerschaft von der spanischen Endesa und der Scottish Power angeführt. Daneben seien unter anderem RWE, Iberdrola, Vattenfall, ENEL und Electrabel beteiligt.ena.fse


© 2000 Reuters Limited.

[DimStar]

für den kurs dürfte das mal wieder überhaupt nichts bedeuten - offenbar glaubt der Markt nicht an die Mega-Exchanges. Dann müssen eben noch einige Jahre vergehen, bis Commerce One die Resultate anhand von Geschäftszahlen vorweisen kann - ich habe die Zeit.

[DimStar]

http://www.opciona.com/cabecera.html

[DimStar]

Endesa To List B2B E-Commerce Unit Before Yr-End >ELE
(Dow Jones)
05/29/2000


MADRID (Dow Jones)--Spanish electricity-based conglomerate Grupo Endesa (ELE)
Monday said it will float its business-to-business e-commerce unit Opciona.com
before year-end.
Endesa`s Opciona.com Web portal is an auction-based market platform for
electricity companies and telecom companies, which matches consumers and
providers.
Opciona.com will have 400 providers by the end of July, according to Alfonso
Calderona, a director of Endesa Marketplace, the company`s investment unit for
technology projects.
Endesa said Opciona.com will earn money through transaction commissions,
licensing and connection fees, as well as consulting services, Calderona said.
Endesa will reap cost-savings of between 10 billion pesetas ($1=ESP179.18)
and ESP20 billion through the portal.
In its first three months of operations, Opciona.com conducted 40 auctions,
worth ESP3 billion in total.
Luis Rivera, an Endesa Marketplace director, couldn`t say how the company
would float Opciona.com on the Spanish markets, but he said that in light of
recent global tech-stock devaluations, it was well-positioned as a
`new-economy` venture carried by `old-economy` business models.
Endesa has made a startup investment of ESP3.5 billion in Opciona.com, and
forecasts that the portal will generate by its third year around ESP30 billion
in revenue and control 30% of the Spanish B2B e-commerce market.
Most recently, three Latin American Endesa units, Cia. Electricidade Estado
de Rio de Janeiro (E.CRJ), Cia. Energetica do Ceara (E.COE), and Chile`s
Distribuidora Chilectra Metropolitana SA (E.CLT) made purchases via
Opciona.com.
Key shareholders in Opciona.com are U.S.-based e-commerce solutions company
Commerce One Inc. (CMRC) with a 10% stake, and consulting agency
PriceWaterhouseCoopers with a 12% stake.
Company Websites: http://www.endesa.es; ttp://www.opciona.com

(END) DOW JONES NEWS 05-29-00
06:10 AM- - 06 10 AM EDT 05-29-00
Copyright 2000 Dow Jones & Company, Inc

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[buckweiser]

Na bitte, da haben wir es doch! Danke, Dimstar

Grüsse, buckweiser

[DimStar]

bin noch lange nicht fertig, das Einkaufsvolumen beträgt fast die Hälfte des gesamten europäischen Markts.

Utilities in net exchange
By Andrew Taylor and Carlos Grande
Published: May 28 2000 12:46GMT | Last Updated: May 29 2000 14:20GMT



A dozen European utilities from eight countries are combining to create one of the region`s biggest internet purchasing exchanges with an initial annual spending power of more than E30bn ($28bn).

Founder members of the exchange, led by Scottish Power in the UK and Endesa of Spain, are looking to capture the bulk of the E66bn spent yearly on goods and services, other than fuel, by European electricity, gas and water utilities.

It is the latest in a series of global and regional online procurement exchanges proposed by leaders of large industries seeking to cut purchasing costs by up to 10 per cent.

Automotive, oil, aerospace and mining companies, spending hundreds of billions of dollars a year, have announced plans for internet business to business procurement sites since the beginning of this year.

European utilities that have agreed to found the latest exchange include Electricite de France, Europe`s biggest power company; Enel, the large Italian state-owned electricity group; RWE, Germany`s biggest power producer; and Electrabel, which supplies most of Belgium`s electricity.

Other members are Vattenfall of Sweden, Nuon of Holland, National Grid, the UK transmission company, as well as United Utilities and Northern Electric, two UK regional electricity companies.

An independent company will be created to own and operate the exchange. Founding members will own initially 80 per cent of the shares. Ken Vowles, director of Scottish Power`s UK electricity operations, said: "The intention is eventually to float the exchange."

The website, which expects to start trading late this summer, has yet to announce which software system it will be using. US start-ups including Ariba and Commerce One have been competing with established companies such as SAP and Oracle to capture this evolving new market.

"Any sized company will be able to purchase or sell goods ranging from steel cables to trucks, computers and paper clips through the internet," said Mr Vowles.

"We expect purchase prices to fall by an average of 10 per cent while the cost of carrying out transactions could halve."

Efficiences would be achieved by removing the need to prepare expensive tender documents. Purchasers would be able to buy from "electronic catalogues" or through open auctions, said Mr Vowles.

Companies would also be able to exchange imformation on best purchasing routes and benchmark their costs against rivals.

Suppliers, however, are anxious that the exchanges may be used to squeeze lower prices from them.

The exchange is one of two proposed European utility procurement websites. The other, called Achilles Marketplace, currently has only British members.

These include: National Power, PowerGen, Anglian Water, South West Water, Yorkshire Water, GPU Power Distribution and the Environment Agency.

[buckweiser]

...und das mit dem Kurs wird schon, denke wir werden jetzt den doppelten Boden sehen und dann geht es stramm nach oben. Wie ist das mit den Umsätzen? Werden doch erstmal nur durch Einmalzahlungen für Initialisierung von Marktplätzen generiert, später folgen Provisionen, oder? Aber ich denke CMRC, wird die Einmalzahlungen geschickt verteilt haben, so dass kontinuierliches Umsatzwachstum gewährleistet ist...

[DimStar]

Achilles läuft unter mysap, das Einkaufsvolumen find ich auch noch raus, moment


Six major UK organisations back new business-to-business Utility portal

Achilles Information Ltd together with SAP UK and Requisite Technology enable new marketplace

PowerGen, the Environment Agency, GPU Power Distribution, South West Water, Anglian Water and Yorkshire Water have today announced their commitment to a new business-to-business marketplace for the utilities and other major organisations. The combined annual spend of the six organisations make this the largest online marketplace being developed for the European utility sector: it will also be the first such service to go live.

In addition to the early adopters listed above, discussions are also at an advanced stage with several other major utility companies. The initiative is primarily utility driven but has also proved its value as a resource to other major UK and European organisations, demonstrated by the early commitment of the Environment Agency.

The online exchange, known as the Achilles Marketplace, will allow suppliers and organisations with a major buying capacity to achieve significant savings on their goods and services by combining detailed content on several thousand European suppliers, with online electronic trading facilities. In addition, the portal will automate a wide range of procurement activities, bringing further efficiencies and cost-savings to both utility buyers and sellers. All companies across the European utility sector will be able to use the portal.

Benefits for participating organisations will include:

price discounts and volume purchase agreements
reduced transaction costs
faster cycle times, reducing time from order to fulfillment
improved range of suppliers
seamless links to a validated information source about suppliers and their performance
greater transparency of information
The Achilles Marketplace will be the first online utility trade exchange to go live: trials are taking place this month and the portal will be launched by the end of June. The launch of the portal is particularly timely for UK utility companies, which are facing mounting pressure to reduce their costs, following the recent regulatory reviews of the sectors.

Since the initial announcement about the development of the marketplace by Achilles, SAP and Requisite Technology in February, the Achilles Marketplace has achieved a unique level of support. Early adopters of the marketplace have been given the option to take equity in the venture with a view to an IPO within two years. Further equity will be made available to other utilities joining the scheme.

Colin Maund, managing director of Achilles comments, "Whilst similar initiatives for the utility sector have been announced in recent months, no other portal has achieved support from this number of utility companies. The portal is being developed in close conjunction with these early adopters: they are all members of a steering committee which is defining the nature and functionality of the service."

As part of the preparation for the launch of the new portal, Achilles has been collecting detailed product-catalogue content on the seven thousand utility suppliers across Europe.

Achilles has run the utility industry-standard database for forty-four utility companies since 1995 and has extensive experience of encouraging collaboration between participating companies. Drawing on this expertise, Achilles Marketplace aims to create a virtual community between the utilities and their suppliers.

Roy Pointer, managing director of Anglian Water Services is totally committed to the value of the portal, commenting: "Anglian Water is an innovative company already involved in e-commerce. We see the Achilles Marketplace as a vital part of our supply chain strategy. By harnessing new technology we can look to deliver further value through purchasing."

Similarly, Bob Baty, chief executive of South West Water says: "The company is committed to achieving excellence in procurement and sees this opportunity as a major step towards achieving this objective. The Achilles Marketplace represents a significant element of South West Water`s future strategy to improve our systems and meet tough efficiency targets."

Achilles Marketplace will allow greater unity and standardisation of procurement processes across Europe. Nick Baldwin, executive director for PowerGen, comments, "PowerGen is committed to exploiting the potential of the electronic revolution to help us save money and make our business more efficient. We are already embracing the benefits of e-commerce for the customer facing part of our business so it is a logical step for us to use e-procurement to deliver benefits in the way we do business with our suppliers."

The portal has been developed by Achilles Information Ltd, in partnership with SAP and Requisite Technology. It is as an open-ended e-commerce solution which will be made available to any relevant organisations, regardless of their own IT infrastructures.



Note to editors`
The Achilles Group is Europe`s leading provider of supplier and contract information and the Achilles Marketplace comes on the back of several highly successful supplier information systems that are currently used by over 400 major purchasing organisations throughout Europe. In the UK, they include the Utilities Vendor Database (UVDB), a community of 44 subscribing utility companies who use the database to source and select suppliers from a pool of over 3000 fully-qualified sellers.

The UVDB will act as an important feature of the Achilles Marketplace and use of the portal will be open to all companies who currently subscribe to the UVDB or one of the other utility databases Achilles operate in Europe. The UVDB subscribers have already requested that Achilles prepare a joint industry catalogue for the utility sector and Achilles are currently working closely with Requisite Technology, one of the world`s leading providers of catalogue content solutions and catalogue finding technology to put this into effect. Requisite have recently begun the process of cataloguing the product and service offerings of key suppliers identified by early-adopters and plan to gradually role out their cataloguing services to other interested suppliers registered on the database.

About Requisite Technology, Inc.
Requisite Technology`s complete, integrated technology spans the crucial elements of a total e-catalog content solution: e-content creation, management and finding. Requisite`s eMerge tools and services improve and unify content from a variety of sources to create consistently classified electronic catalogs for buyers, suppliers and marketplaces. The patented BugsEye finding engine allows desktop users to find what they need, using intuitive, common language requests. Based in Westminster, Colo., with operations in Toronto and London, Requisite`s solutions are deployed on hundreds of thousands of desktops in more than 15 countries. Oracle Corp. recognized Requisite as one of four "Most Innovative E-Business Solution Developers on Oracle" in 1999. Find out more at www.requisite.com.

About SAP
As the market leader of inter-enterprise software solutions, SAP is leveraging its strength in industry-focused business software and the world`s largest enterprise software customer base to deliver mySAP.com. mySAP.com provides an open collaborative business environment of personalised solutions on demand. This enables companies of all sizes and industries to fully engage their employees, customers and partners to capitalise upon the new Internet economy.

mySAP.com allows people to harness the power of the Internet to work smarter, better and faster by optimising supply chains, managing strategic relationships, reducing time to market, sharing virtual information, and increasing productivity and shareholder value.

SAP is listed on several exchanges including the Frankfurt stock exchange and NYSE under the symbol "SAP." The SAP World Wide Web site can be found at http://www.sap.com.

[buckweiser]

Und jetzt noch eine Zusammenfassung in 2-3 Sätzen, dann wäre ich glücklich, wie schätzt Du die Sache ein(insbesondere in Bezug auf SAP, Oracle und Ariba)?

[Ronny-D]

Hi,

Ziel kann nicht sein durch Einmalzahlungen Umsätze zu generieren.
Die große Chance ergibt sich doch erst durch das Partizipieren von
Umsätzen anderer. Ich kenne zwar keine Details (dafür bin ich in
letzter Zeit zu selten an Board), denke aber das CMRC wie gewohnt
vorgeht.
Natürlich wird auch diese neue, sehr erfreuliche Meldung mal wieder
am Kurs vorbeigehen.

Aber wie DimStar schon sagte: Man (Frau) muß Zeit haben.

Ich denke, wenn erstens die schlechte Börsenlage vorbei ist, wird
CMRC zu den ersten Profiteuren gehören und zweitens, wenn die Um-
satz- bzw. Gewinnerwartungen noch 5-6 Quartale mehr als bestätigt
werden, werden auch die letzten Blinden merken, welch eine Goldgrube
CMRC eigentlich ist.

Ich hoffe nur, daß möglichst viele die Geduld aufbringen. Wäre schade
um die verpasste Chance.

Ronny

[buckweiser]

Das mit den Einmalzahlungen ist klar, damit schiele ich ja nur auf die nächsten Quartalszahlen, hoffe, dass die nicht enttäuschen, da Provisionen wohl erst ab dem 3. Quartal in signifikanter Höhe (was auch immer das heisst)erreicht werden können...

[DimStar]

Achilles ist zwar ein unabhängiger Marktplatz, SAP liefert aber die technologie. das einkaufsvolumen habe ich nicht finden können, aber der Marktplatz scheint mir mit 6 britischen Teilnehmern doch um einiges kleiner zu sein.

[buckweiser]

hab gerade mein erstes posting bei ragingbull gemacht, damit die amis auch bescheid wissen

[Ronny-D]

Für die Umsätze hoffe ich das auch, aber bezüglich der Gewinnerwartungen werden wir Geduld haben müssen.
Im Moment ist noch nicht abzusehen wie die Goodwillabschreibungen sich in Zukunft entwickeln werden. Die machen mir doch etwas sorgen.
Ein bißchen Historie (in Mio $):

Quartal .. Goodwill .. Anteil am Umsatz

1/99 .......... 875 ......... 41,6%
2/99 ........ 1049 ......... 25,0%
3/99 ........ 1053 ......... 10,2%
4/99 ........ 8156 ......... 48,3%
1/00 ...... 21895 ......... 62,5%

Wohlgemerkt. Die 62,5% sind nicht der Anteil an den Kosten, sondern am Umsatz.

Ronny

[Meister+M+]

Wenn die Unterstützungslinie bei 37 hält, dann gehts wieder aufwärts Wenn nicht, würde ich verkaufen

[DimStar]

schön, daß du noch dabei bist, Ronny

Commerce One hat ein flexibles Modell, aus dem eine Vielzahl von Einnahmemöglichkeiten angewandt werden können. Im wesentlichen gibt es da 4 Bereiche: Lizensierung, Services, Beteiligung, Transaktionsprovisionen. CMRC hat mit allen 77 Portalkunden transaktionsbasierte Vereinbarungen in unbekannter Größenordnung getroffen. Je nach Kundenbedarf wird das pricing stärker nach der der Einmalinvestition oder der joint-venture-Beteiligung oder nach dem Transaktionsvolumen gehen. Endesa z.b. sorgte laut letztem Quartalsbericht für 14 % der gesamten Q1-Umsätze, wobei CMRC mit 10 % am Joint-Venture (opciona.com) beteiligt ist. Vielleicht ergeben sich daher bei der Endesa weniger hohe Provisionserlöse. CMRC sagte im Januar, daß es erst in Q4 zu ersten kleinen transaktionsbasierten Umsätzen kommen wird. Im conference-call für Q1 war schon die Rede davon, daß dies bereits im 2. Quartal der Fall sein könnte, im 3. Quartal wolle man diese Einnahmequelle auch bilanziell ausweisen.

buckweiser, ich möchte nicht soweit gehen, daß es einen Zusammenhang zwischen dem möglichen reseller-vertrag zwischen SAP und CMRC und wiederum dieser Meldung gibt, weil mysap keine weiteren kunden gewinnt, aber ich denke, wir wissen, welches unternehmen im begriff ist, marktanteile zu gewinnen. die zukunft wird es uns zeigen.

[DimStar]

bzgl. goodwill hast du sicher recht. CMRC hat bereits vorbörslich einige firmen aufgekauft, CommerceBid und Mergent kamen dann hinzu. Die US-Analysten binden goodwill-afa allerdings nicht in ihre gewinnerwartungen ein. zumindest enthalten die earningsschätzungen keine derartigen Kosten. Dies ist m.E. auch nachvollziehbar, denn CMRC verwässert das Ergebnis bereits durch Vergabe eigener Aktien zur Übernahme neuer Gesellschaften. Wird in Cash bezahlt, trägt CMRC Zinsaufwendungen oder verwässert das Ergebnis durch eine Barkapitalerhöhung. Würde man auch noch die goodwill vom Ergebnis abziehen, würde man Aufwendungen doppelt berücksichtigen. nach HGB sieht die sache zwar anders aus, aber die amerikanische form wird sich früher oder später durchsetzen.

[buckweiser]

Endesa Marketplace, S.A. Launches Its Portal Opciona.com to Become the Leader inB2B
Tue May 30 12:29:00 EDT 2000

NEW YORK, May 30, 2000 (BUSINESS WIRE) -- -- ENDESA MARKETPLACE announces the
commercial launching of its

portal Opciona.com -- In its first three weeks of operation, Endesa Marketplace
has

completed on-line auctions for a total value of Eur 18 million,

enabling direct savings of around Eur 2.7 million -- ENDESA is also promoting a
large B2B platform among Europe`s

leading utilities -- Together with Euskaltel, Amena, Retevision and Airtel,
ENDESA


fosters the creation of a B2B telecommunications portal.

Endesa Marketplace, S.A., majority-owned by Endesa, S.A. (ELE:NYSE), announced
yesterday the commercial launching of Opciona.com, its B2B portal. Opciona.com
will use the technology developed by Commerce One, the world leader in B2B
solutions, with which it is the exclusive partner in Spain.

The initial investment in the portal will be Eur 21 million, with expected
revenues for the third year of around Eur 180 million. The company expects to
carry out a flotation before the end of 2000.

Plans for the coming weeks include incorporating at least 400 new suppliers to
the platform, new alliances and agreements with other companies and portals, the
commercial launching of third-party on-line auctions and the start of activities
in Europe and Latin America.


First Three Weeks of Operations

In its first three weeks of operations Endesa Marketplace has conducted over 40
on-line auctions, enabling several of Endesa`s affiliates both in Spain (ERZ,
Sevillana) and Latin America (Cerj, Coelce, Codensa, Edelnor and Chilectra) to
purchase products such as cables and transformers for an amount of approximately
Eur 18 million.

The above auctions had offers from over 20 suppliers located in 12 countries,
with up to 15 suppliers taking part in each auction. The auctions were
successful both in terms of the number of offers made and the savings achieved
both in time and prices. Total savings achieved by the affiliates of Endesa in
the auctions are estimated to be Eur 2.7 million.


B2B Platform for European Utilities

ENDESA is fostering the creation of a large B2B platform for an independent
market of supplies for utilities. An agreement has been signed with Scottish
Power, EDF, Electrabel, ENEL, Iberdrola, National Grid, Northern Electric, Nuon,
RWE, United Utilities and Vattenfall. Conversations are being held with other
leading European corporations which are expected to become partners in the
project in the short term.

This platform is initially focused on the electricity industry, although in the
future its scope may be enlarged to include gas and water. The platform will be
operated by an independent company in which its founding partners will hold 80%
of its share capital, the remaining 20% to be distributed among other
technological partners (including suppliers), employees, advisors and technology
providers. The operating company is expected to be listed in the future.

Commercial operations are expected to start before the end of this summer. They
will initially be focused on sales by catalogue, auctions and supply management.


B2B Platform for Telecommunications

ENDESA, Euskaltel, Retevision, Amena and Airtel have signed an agreement to lead
the creation of a B2B platform for telecommunications activities, open to
companies both in Spain and abroad. The portal will be operated by a company
which is to be incorporated in the near future.

This new portal is expected to become operational in the early autumn this year.
It is expected to conduct transactions for a volume of Eur 1.8 billion in its
first year of operation and of Eur 6 billion in the third. The partners expect
the portal to become mature enough for its flotation during 2001.

ENDESA will act both as a partner in the new venture and as an engine for the
transactions in the portal since the latter will use Endesa Marketplace`s
technological platform based on Commerce One`s technology.


Other Agreements Reached by Endesa Marketplace

Apart from the above, Endesa Marketplace has reached the following agreements:

-- An agreement with the Spanish construction company Dragados

enabling its e-difica.com portal to use opciona.com`s platform -- An agreement
with Danzas and Citibank to become part of the


international suppliers of logistic and financial services,
respectively.

[DimStar]

Endesa scheint ja schwer begeistert von der cmrc-plattform zu sein. die 2 neuen Plattformen scheint man von opcionas.com zu trennen. dies bestärkt mich in der annahme, daß Telcos, Banken oder auch eben Versorgungsunternehmen noch zahlreiche Plattformen aufstellen werden, um sich für ihre große kundengemeinde als transaktionsanbieter im internet zu etablieren. ich habe keinen zweifel daran, daß cmrc der technologiepartner sein wird. generell würde ich meinen, daß sich eine GM, eine Royal Dutch oder BP, Boeing oder Dt. Telekom oder BT oder NTT niemals von CMRC trennen werden, wenn solche meldungen über anlaufende geschäfte kommen. eine konsolidierung unter den geschaffenen plattformen ist zukünftig sicher unumgänglich und dann wird derjenige technologielieferant mit dem größten marktanteil der gewinner sein. folgender artikel zeigt aber, daß wir erst ganz am anfang der entwicklung stehen. ob GM es schaffen wird, bereits in 2001 wie geplant den gesamten einkauf online abzuwickeln, darf man getrost bezweifeln.

Customers Are Using B2B Exchanges to Get Prices -- and Buy Offline
By Joe Bousquin
Staff Reporter
5/31/00 8:14 AM ET




If only the computer terminal you`re reading this on had a coin slot mounted on its side. That way, it`d be a lot easier to make money off of the Internet.

Yet, as so many business-to-consumer companies have painfully learned in the last six months, that`s not the way it works. The Internet, it turns out, is a great medium for communicating and sharing stuff -- like information -- but it`s still really hard to make money at it.

A lot of B2B players are in for the same harsh lesson now, some analysts say. As businesses actually start using the Internet to do business, an interesting thing is happening: People who work for businesses, the analysts are finding, act a lot like the people shopping for themselves -- they try to save money. That, in turn, makes it very hard for the companies trying to sell them things to make a profit.

"The bottom line is that you want to get the best price you can," says Jon Ekoniak, B2B analyst at U.S. Bancorp Piper Jaffray. In a recent report analyzing the sector, Ekoniak wrote that many companies are basing their entire B2B business model on aggregating pricing information, a strategy that he thinks will ultimately be self-defeating. In short, they may be providing their customers with just enough information to shop elsewhere.

"Essentially, we believe that product and pricing visibility, the cornerstone of many B2B sites, will be commoditized," Ekoniak wrote. "This information may now be required as the price of admission into the B2B world, but we believe to base a business model on this information is a losing proposition."

Some sites that aggregate pricing information, while bringing together communities of buyers and sellers -- so-called market makers -- are VerticalNet (VERT:Nasdaq), MetalSite and ChemConnect.

B2B sites are likely to have the information turned back on them. As an example, Ekoniak cites farmers who routinely use the Web to research the best prices on supplies they need -- say fertilizer or pesticides -- and then take that quote to their trusted local supplier as a bargaining chip.

"If farmers are going out and saying, `This is the price I can get on the Web, what can you do for me?`, what does that mean for other businesses?" Ekoniak said.

What it may mean is a lot of bad news, particularly because people are usually willing -- whether for themselves or their employers -- to do a little legwork to save some money. We`ve seen it in the B2C space too many times before.

Take the example of automobile purchasing. J.D. Power and Associates says that 40% of new-vehicle buyers used the Internet to research their purchase during the first part of 1999, and it expects that to increase to 65% by the end of this year. But less than 5% of new-car shoppers, the research firm found, actually purchase vehicles online.

Instead, like the farmers, they go to their local dealer to try to get the best price possible. Which means for the dealers themselves, profits are going down, not up. J.D. Power, for instance, found that 75% of car dealers responding to its survey said sales generated by online buying services resulted in lower gross profits on their overall sales.

With B2B exchanges popping up by the day, the availability of pricing and product information -- now the carrot used to attract corporate buyers` eyes -- is likely to become a must-have for any B2B site. But to keep those eyeballs, B2B companies will need collaborative add-ons that allow customers to transact their business online. After all, it`s still a painful reality of the business world that while many items are listed online, ordering and payment is still done with faxes and paper checks.

"It`s like ordering a book online at Amazon.com (AMZN:Nasdaq) and getting a bill three weeks later in the mail," says Bob Austrian, B2B analyst for Banc of America Securities. "The real promise of B2B now lies in reducing the cost of doing business with suppliers, customers and partners, not merely in providing more information."

Austrian says only those B2B players that can actually connect buyers` and suppliers` back-office departments -- say purchasing and receiving -- with one another, or those who enable businesses to collaborate together in outsourcing tasks, will be the ones to gain traction in the B2B future. And those are two very complex tasks.

"People are talking about finding the best price for latex gloves," Austrian says. "That`s useful, but not nearly as much as helping the supplier of latex gloves significantly reduce the cost of doing business with it."

Other factors in the B2B world that are starting to sound very B2C: layoffs and pulled IPOs. Just last week, medical B2B player Neoforma (NEOF:Nasdaq) announced a restructuring complete with 80 job cuts, while B2B incubator divine interVentures said it would lay off approximately 10% of its workforce. On top of that, the S1s are starting to disappear: Much-anticipated offerings from Noosh and Impresse last week crawled back into the relative comfort -- at least for now -- of being closely held.

All this comes at a time when the term "B2B" is just now becoming recognized by the masses. Relative to B2C, then, B2B is coming apart at the seams with horrific speed, even in light of the sickening state of consumer-oriented Web sites.

"On a real macro level, what you`re seeing is the life cycle that played itself out in B2C play itself out much more quickly in B2B," says Edward McCabe, B2B analyst for Merrill Lynch. "We came out more quickly, capitalized more quickly, and now we`re having the shakeout much more quickly."

In fact, one mantra that the huge investment bank and research firm has been stressing for the past several months is that 75% of B2C Internet companies will likely not survive independently over the next five years. And the outlook for B2B could be even worse.

"I wouldn`t be surprised to see a shakeout in B2B similar to that, if not even more Draconian," says McCabe. "If you are one of seven potential market makers in a given industry, two might make it. Numbers 3, 4 and 5 won`t."


For more unique perspective on Wall Street try TheStreet.com.Click here for a FREE 30-day subscription!

[DimStar]

Weil so viele von uns deutschsprachigen Anlegern warscheinlich auf der heutigen Hauptversammlung von cmrc zugegen waren, ist der folgende Bericht eines us-anlegers ganz interessant:

Shareholders` Meeting (1)
by: tuvanspirit 5/31/00 8:40 pm
Msg: 45102 of 45105
I attended CMRC shareholders` meeting today, and this is a brief report on that meeting. Some of what Mark Hoffman said in the meeting as I remember are:

.CMRC has the largest global network of marketplaces, and it is growing rapidly. The total amount of buying and selling capability of the member corporations (not necessarily over the net, I assume -- tuvan) will be approximately 1 trillion dollars, and 4 million people are accessible to the network.

.Currently 21 mega exchanges are being planned all over the world. CMRC is going after every one of them. Competition`s two portals are not running yet. CMRC is in a good position because it can show how CMRC`s portals look like.

.CMRC has approximately 1,300 employees now, and growing.

.In a typical manufacturing company operation, profit is about 9 percent of the total revenue (or cost), and 33 percent of the total cost is in indirect cost. It means that if 3 percent of direct cost is saved, the profit of corporation will be doubled. CMRC`s portal based exchange will help manufacturers increase profit by reducing indirect cost.

.Currently operational supply chains are serial type -- for example, GM orders car parts to tier 1 supplier, then tier 1 supplier will order some of its parts to tier 2 supplier, and so on and so forth. Supply chains are serially connected. The portal based supply chain changes all that. In the portal based supply chain, all suppliers are connected to the portal in a parallel fashion, and everybody can talk to everybody else at the same time. This method will eliminate much waste currently observed in supply chain.

Mark Hoffman said that he used to think that small suppliers may not be able to survive if the new portal based system is put in operations. But, now, he does not think so any more because suppliers too can save money by reducing waste in their operation. He thinks that the new system is good for both suppliers and buyers. The only ones who lose will be those who do not participate.

He also said that CMRC is educating suppliers so that they will understand the system. He thinks that in 18 months, there will be no suppliers who will not understand the new system.

[/b].CMRC will come up with new SCM software this quarter.[/b]

.Somebody asked when FTC will give an O.K. to the auto exchange. Hoffman said that FTC is not obliged to say yes or no until it knows exactly what auto exchange does and how it looks like. Members of auto exchange have not finalized the form of its operation. In anticipation of formalization of auto exchange, FTC has started to study the system, and CMRC is helping them so that they can understand the system.

Shareholders` Meeting (2)
by: tuvanspirit 5/31/00 8:50 pm
Msg: 45104 of 45105
.Hoffman said that b2b e-business itself and the way CMRC conducts business is changing every three months. He said that CMRC`s business right now is more in selling software licenses.

.Over the next two quarters, CMRC`s main revenue source will be from software licensing, but not transaction fees. This is a good news for stockholders because it shows that CMRC is still growing rapidly.

.Somebody asked whether or not CMRC will be able to get transaction revenues from future exchanges. Hoffman thinks that CMRC will not be able to charge the same percentage of transaction revenues two years from now as they do today. Robert Tarkoff said that it does not mean that CMRC will not receive any revenues. In the contract with each exchange, CMRC and exchange specifically agree on the percentage of revenues CMRC will receive from the exchange.

.Somebody asked why SAP`s logo was not shown in slides together with PeopleSoft. Mark Hoffman said that he cannot talk about SAP. But, then after a brief pause, he said SAP is the largest portal. He did not elaborate whether it is a portal of CMRC or not. It was obvious to me that he was intentionally vague on SAP.

.Hoffman thinks that CMRC will become break even in the fourth quarter of 2001. He said CMRC will be cash neutral till then, meaning that it can maintain the cash reserve of about $100 million till the operation turns profitable. He said it does not mean that CMRC will not receive any cash interjections. He said that CMRC can become profitable before then, if it does not hire more people to go after new exchanges. But, if CMRC selects that way, it will not grow rapidly. He thinks that the most important thing for CMRC to do now is to actively go after more exchanges.

Mark Hoffman was very upbeat, and I felt very good about Hoffman and the management team, and the meeting. It was obvious that these guys have great understanding of b2b e-commerce. I am hoping that CMRC will come out with super-sophisticated SCM software that is tailor-made to CMRC marketplaces.

There may be some errord in what I wrote here. If so, I apologize. It`s not intentional.

Have a good day,
TuvanSpirit


http://messages.yahoo.com/bbs?.mm=FN&action=m&board=21750636…

[AndyBusch]

Hallo
Gehört zwar nicht direkt zu Endesa, aber da es in dem zitierten Beitrag von Dimstar
http://www.thestreet.com/markets/marketfeatures/949581.html angesprochen wird, wollte ich auf einen durchaus ernstzunehmenden Kritikpunkt eingehen.

B2B sites are likely to have the information turned back on them. As an example, Ekoniak cites farmers who routinely use the Web to research the best prices on supplies they need -- say fertilizer or pesticides -- and then take that quote to their trusted local supplier as a bargaining chip. .

"If farmers are going out and saying, `This is the price I can get on the Web, what can you do for me?`, what does that mean for other businesses?" Ekoniak said.

und die Folge davon:

Instead, like the farmers, they go to their local dealer to try to get the best price possible. Which means for the dealers themselves, profits are going down, not up. J.D. Power, for instance, found that 75% of car dealers responding to its survey said sales generated by online buying services resulted in lower gross profits on their overall sales. .

Der Gewinner ist der Kunde/Verbaucher. Dass der Konsument [/i]ein[/i] Nutznießer von B2B sein wird, ist sicher unbestritten.
=> eine loose-loose-Situation für die B2B-Unternehmen und ortsansässige Firmen.
Im Einzelfall mag das durchaus zutreffen. Man sollte den Vergleich mit B2C allerdings nicht überstrapazieren. Warum der Vergleich mit B2C und nicht C2C (ebay) ?
Aber strapazieren wir den Vergleich mit B2C mal über:

Beispiel 1: Buchung eines 2-wöchigen Karibikurlaubs.
"Zufällig" habe ich etwa ein Dutzend Online-Reisebüros als Favoriten im IE. Ich suche mir also ein optimales Angebot heraus, gehe dann zum Reisebüro um die Ecke und möchte ein Angebot zum gleichen Preis . Die werden mir was erzählen.
Es ist interessanterweise auch ein preislicher Unterschied, ob ich beim gleichen Reisebüre online oder "offline" buche.
Ich vermute das hat einen Grund.
meine letzten 2 Urlaube habe ich übrigens übers Internet gebucht .

Beispiel 2: Kauf eines Buches:
Vom Ablauf genauso wie oben. Ich suche z.B. einen Reiseführer von Australien über Amazon und gehe dann zu Hugendubel um diesen für den gleichen Preis erwerben . Ich tippe er wird bei Hugendubel etwas teuerer sein.

Beispiel 3 Anlageberatung:
Wie wollen Repräsentanzbanken verhindern, dass sich der Kunde ausführlich beraten läßt, aber die Order letztlich bei seiner Direktbank aufgibt. (außer mittels Beratungsgebühren).

Diese Liste ließe sich beliebig verlängern ...

Letztes Beispiel bringt mich auf den eigentlichen Punkt:

Ich glaube, dass eher das Gegenteil richtig ist, man also genau anders herum argumentieren kann:
Der Kunde informiert sich über das zu erwerbende Produkt erst im Geschäft ("offline") und kauft es dann billiger Online.

Aber wie schon festgestellt: man sollte den Vergleich mit B2C nicht überstrapazieren.
Je nach Wahl der Beispiele kommt man zu anderen Schlußfolgerungen.

Interessanter finde ich, dass C1 jetzt auch im SCM-Geschäft mitmischen will. Als das Unternehmen, das quasi das Betriebssystem zur Verfügung stellt (GTW), haben sie sicher eine gute Ausgangsposition. Ob das reicht um gegen I2 anzukommen ?

Grüße
Andy

p.s. langsam könnte es mal zur Abwechslung mit dem Kurs von C1 wieder nach oben gehen.

[watch@it]

Genau das ist der Fall. Aktuell respektable 8,3% im Plus an der Nasdaq. Diese Aktie ist echt nichts für schwache Nerven, gestern 10% runter, heute fast genausoviel wieder hoch...

[buckweiser]

Energy Utility E-Marketplace Consortium Forms New Company, Announces New Participants and Selects Technology Partner
THE WOODLANDS, Texas, June 1 /PRNewswire/ -- The consortium of 15 leading North American energy and utility companies formed earlier this year today announced the legal formation of Pantellos Corporation to operate and manage an open, independent Internet e-marketplace for the purchase of goods and services between the energy industry and its suppliers. To date, six additional companies have joined the original 15 members in the e-marketplace.

The new members of Pantellos are Carolina Power & Light (NYSE: CPL), DTE Energy (NYSE: DTE), Dominion Resources (NYSE: D), El Paso Energy (NYSE: EPG), GPU, Inc. (NYSE: GPU) and Ontario Power Generation. They join American Electric Power (NYSE: AEP), Cinergy (NYSE: CIN), Consolidated Edison International, Inc. (NYSE: ED), Duke Energy (NYSE: DUK), Edison International (NYSE: EIX), Entergy (NYSE: ETR), FirstEnergy Corp. (NYSE: FE), FPL Group (NYSE: FPL), PG&E Corp. (NYSE: PCG), Public Service Enterprise Group (NYSE: PEG), Reliant Energy (NYSE: REI), Sempra Energy (NYSE: SRE), Southern Company (NYSE: SO), TXU Corp. (NYSE: TXU) and Unicom (NYSE: UCM).

Pantellos will have an initial capitalization of $100 million. It will use the proceeds to fund development and deliver of a broad suite of technology enabled supply chain solutions and provide the necessary capital for ongoing operations.

The consortium also announced selection of Commerce One (Nasdaq: CMRC) as the primary technology partner. Commerce One is the leader in global e-commerce solutions for business. "The global reach and domain knowledge of the consortium combined with Commerce One`s recognized leadership in e-commerce technology solutions, will enable us to establish a premier exchange," said Mark Hoffman, chairman and CEO of Commerce One.

Morgan Stanley Dean Witter has been retained as the financial advisor for the new company. "Morgan Stanley is excited to be a contributor to the creation and launch of Pantellos," said Ken Marks, principal of Morgan Stanley. "The consortium`s leadership, speed of execution and level of cooperation set extremely high standards, which provide strong expectations for the success of this e-marketplace going forward."

The professional services firm of PricewaterhouseCoopers is providing business advice and assisting in the development of the e-marketplace.

Pantellos (pan-TELLos) is derived from a Greek word that can be interpreted as "complete" or "absolute." The name reflects the company`s goal of providing integrated e-supply chain solutions to both buyers and suppliers in the energy marketplace. To date, Pantellos has initiated contact with some 1,500 suppliers to begin forging strong, mutually beneficial relationships in areas of interest and opportunity to all supply chain participants. The company is seeking participation from all interested suppliers and is scheduling regional workshops to provide more opportunity for dialogue.

For more information about the exchange, please visit its Website at: www.pantellos.com

[goodi]

hallo leute,

nennt mir mal eine aktie, welche in den letzten

3 monaten aufträge in der dimension einer commerce one

an land gezogen hat. das würde ja schon bis hierhin für

die nächsten 2 Jahre reichen.

der umsatzsprung quartal 1 war eine überraschung,

die nächsten quartalszahlen werden vom umsatz her

sensationen werden. die haben doch arbeit bis unters dach.

so deutlich kann man m.e. die entwicklung einer aktie

selten erkennen.

mfg. goodi

[buckweiser]

....zurücklehnen und freuen auf eine sorgenfreie Zukunft

[Green_Ninja]

hi buck ,


vergess nicht beim zurücklehnen die beine auf den tisch zu legen .

lies mal die new`s im Raging bull von C1 .

Ps : verrate mal dein kursziel von C1

CU Green

[buckweiser]

Kurziel: hatte mal nen pushversuch mit 500$ im März gestartet, ist jetzt wohl etwas unrealistisch, CMRC ist eine Aktie, die man auch in 5 Jahren noch halten kann

[Green_Ninja]

500$ in 5 jahren sehen wir mehr

dieses jahr bestimmt noch 150 $ , ich bin überzeugt das in November/Dezember noch ein split kommt

CU

[goodi]

endlich haben es die amis auch kapiert.
plus 14,6%.

übrigens danke an BUCKWEISER
, durch deine postings
bin ich erst zum bekennenden cmrc fan geworden.
ist jetzt meine mit abstand größte position.

habe für deine nicht investierten 5% einen hochspekulativen
tipp.
TREASURY INTERNAT. (916085) us kürzel TREY

heute im hoch über +80% !!
es gibt einige threads über TREY. bitte mit "stichwort"
suchen, erhöht die trefferquote.

mfg. goodi

[goodi]

die alten höchstkurse werden wir dieses jahr noch
übertreffen-mit dem unterschied, daß ich jetzt
ca. 10 mal höher investiert bin.

mfg. goodi

[buckweiser]

ich schau sie mir mal an

Grüsse, buckweiser

[Master P]

....Langsam glaube ich immer mehr daran, dass C1 eine (kleine) Yahoo wird....!! Ver10fachung in relativ kurzer Zeit.....60-80% Korrektur....viele sehen C1 schon nicht mehr sooo positiv (B.Förtsch u.a.) !!! Das ALLERGLEICHE fand bei Yahoo ebenfalls statt!!!!!!!
PS:....heute zum letzten Mal unter 40 ?!?! Wetten,.....!!!!

[buckweiser]

ich hatte yahoo auch schon in 1997, bin damit grossgeworden(verkauf anfang 2000, dann B2B)

[DimStar]

Investoren, die den b2b-markt genauer beobachten, müßte mittlerweile nun wirklich klar sein, daß Commerce One zum unangefochtenen Weltmarktführer aufsteigt. Larry Ellison wird es noch bereuen von dem "guy called Hoffman" gesprochen zu haben, da eine Riesenschar von Applikationen nicht nur in die Plattformen integriert werden, sondern vor allem, weil die B2B-Plattform im Mittelpunkt der Firmenstrategieen stehen werden.


Energy companies unveil name for Net marketplace
June 01, 2000
by Adam Feuerstein

Twenty-one energy and utility companies have chosen a name and a technology partner for their previously announced plans to build an online marketplace.

Pantellos Corp., the new moniker, will be an open, independent Net marketplace linking energy and utility companies with their suppliers. It will have an initial capitalization of $100 million to fund development and for ongoing operations, the companies say.


Commerce One (CMRC) was chosen over rivals Ariba (ARBA) and Oracle (ORCL) to provide the e-commerce technology for the marketplace. Other partners announced today include Morgan Stanley Dean Witter and PricewaterhouseCoopers.


At this point, industry-led efforts to form business-to-business Net marketplaces have focused more on coming up with a catchy name than actually building an operating business.


The energy companies in the consortium say that Pantellos is derived from a Greek word that can be interpreted as "complete" or "absolute," and was chosen because it reflects the company`s goal of providing "integrated e-supply chain solutions to both buyers and suppliers in the energy marketplace."


But at this point, Pantellos has little else but a name. The consortium says it has contacted about 1,500 suppliers about participating in the marketplace, but none have signed on to date. A timetable for a launch of the marketplace has not been set.


Just last month, General Motors (GM), Ford (F) and DaimlerChrysler (DCX) took the wraps off Covisint, the name for its much-hyped online auto exchange; while a similar effort by paper and forest products makers Georgia-Pacific (GP), International Paper (IP) and Weyerhaeuser Corp. (WY) will be called ForestExpress.com.


Founding members of Pantellos, originally announced in March, are American Electric Power (AEP), Cinergy (CIN), Consolidated Edison International (ED), Duke Energy (DUK), Edison International (EIX), Entergy (ETR), FirstEnergy Corp. (FE), FPL Group (FPL), PG&E Corp. (PCG), Public Service Enterprise Group (PEG), Reliant Energy (REI), Sempra Energy (SRE), Southern Co. (SO), TXU Corp. (TXU) and Unicom (UCM).


These utilities are joined by new members: Carolina Power & Light (CPL), DTE Energy (DTE), Dominion Resources (D), El Paso Energy (EPG), GPU Inc. (GPU) and Ontario Power Generation.



Ich habe mir mal die Mühe gemacht und die Umsätze dieser Firmen zusammengerechnet. Es sind 186 Milliarden Dollar. In etwa die Hälfte kann man groberweise vielleicht als Einkaufsvolumen kalkulieren. Da wären wir bei ca 90 Mrd. Der Markt für die Beschaffung der nordamerikanischen Energiewirtschaft beträgt lt. Firmenmitteillung 130 Mrd $. So kann man auch bei dieser Mega-Exchange davon ausgehen, daß sie sich in ihrem Bereich durchsetzen wird. Wir haben hier die 4. Mega-Exchange, 21 sind von Commerce One geplant. Die nächste Mega-Exchange wird m.E. unter Führung von International Paper, Weyerhaeuser und Georgia-Pacific in der Papierbranche kommen. Vorgestern wurde mit ForestExpress.com ein Name festgelegt, der Technologielieferant fehlt noch. Weyerhaeuser ist CMRC-Kunde. Es gibt bereits eine Konkurrenzplattform namens PaperExchange.com, die die Internet Capital Group im Rücken hat und International Paper als Kunden hatte - eben ... hatte. Ariba z.B. hat in diesem Bereich keine Kunden. Allein diese 3 Firmen bringen es auf einen Jahresumsatz von 55 Mrd $ und es gibt sicherlich noch die ein oder andere weitere Papierfabrik in den Staaten.

[DimStar]

Andy,
daß die scm-software wettbewerbsfähig wird (künftige updates), ist langfristig das ganz entscheidende. aus dem stand werden sie mit i2 nicht mithalten können. Damit könnte cmrc unmäßig viel Geld verdienen, da sie bereits für ganze Branchen den Einkauf ins Internet bringen. Wie Mary Meeker schon sagte: "Simple transactions will be almost free." Wenn ich aber eine eine Bestellanfrage umgekehrt verauktionieren lasse (Lieferanten unterbieten sich), wenn ich die Produktion angefangen vom Eisen bis zur Autotür mit einer Software in mehreren Unternehmen durchplane (scm), content-management, logistik, kundenanalyse, marketingsysteme und was weiß ich noch für services im zusammenhang mit der plattform anbiete, dann verdiene ich Geld.
bzgl. deinen b2c-vergleichen stimme ich zu. Die Tatsache, an der kein B2B-Kritiker vorbeikommt ist einfach, daß die Großunternehmen B2B via Internet betreiben, verstärkt betreiben werden und mit der Gründung von Plattformen Erträge erwirtschaften werden, da man zum eigenen e-commerce-player wird. Daß nach einem halben Jahr noch nicht viel läuft, war doch klar. Wer sich die Summen ansieht, um die es geht, legt eben vorerst Wert auf die Organisation.

noch ein interessanter artikel bzgl. des gesamtmarkts:

BURNHAM`S BEAT: `Meta networks` will pull apart B2B exchanges

By Bill Burnham ZDII


These days everyone seems fascinated with business-to-business exchanges. These exchanges promise to automate buying and selling within a particular industry and give big industrial markets the same kind of efficiency and transparency found in most stock markets.

To that end, it seems as though not a day goes by without someone claiming to be creating the Nasdaq of one industry or another. For example, GM (NYSE: GM), Daimler-Chrysler (NYSE: DCX) and Ford (NYSE: F) recently got together to form a giant auto industry exchange. Groups of companies in other industries, such airlines and hotels, have also recently announced their own exchanges.

Unfortunately for many of these new ventures, just as the fervor for B2B exchanges is reaching its peak, new trends and technologies are making centralized exchanges much less valuable and relevant than they were just a few short months ago.

EBay Wannabes

The current obsession with these B2B exchanges is driven in large part by the success of one company: EBay. EBay (Nasdaq: EBAY) pioneered consumer Internet auctions and is seen as the poster child for all Internet exchanges.

What B2B Exchanges like the most about eBay is scale -- the bigger eBay gets, the harder it is for its competitors to keep pace. This is known as the network effect. Network effects are a fancy way of saying that the bigger a site becomes the more attractive it is for people to use it. Thus, with network effects, successful Internet sites become like a giant black hole where their increasing mass sucks up more and more customers. Growth is allegedly infinite.

The Great B2B Exchange Rush

The network effect has B2B exchanges racing to market. The idea is that the first exchange to generate network effects in each major market will become the insurmountable leader, forever reigning over their particular patch of the B2B landscape.

In an effort to cater to this enthusiasm for exchanges, an entire industry has sprung up to help build B2B exchanges. You know the cast already. CommerceOne (Nasdaq: CMRC), Ariba (Nasdaq: ARBA), Oracle (Nasdaq: ORCL), i2 (Nasdaq: ITWO), VerticalNet (Nasdaq: VERT) and others racing to provide B2B software platforms. Some of the earliest B2B exchanges, such as Ventro (Nasdaq: VTRO) and Neoforma (Nasdaq: NEOF) have even managed to go public. Meanwhile, exchanges such as Aribinet and Paper Exchange.com have filed for IPOs.

Investor enthusiasm for exchanges is largely based on the belief that successful exchanges will enjoy a near monopoly. These dominant players will then throw off tons of cash as they collect a small fee on every transaction.

Meta-Networks Ruin The Party

Unfortunately, just as exchange mania is reaching its peak, new companies are threatening to undermine the long-term value of exchanges by decreasing the network effect.

How are they doing this? By creating, for lack of better word, "Meta networks." Meta networks are networks of networks and they enable Internet users to access numerous exchanges at the same time.

When users have such a consolidated view of all the possible exchanges within a particular market, the value of any single market decreases dramatically.

Drawn and Quartered

Just look at eBay. Lots of companies including Yahoo (Nasdaq: YHOO) and Amazon (Nasdaq: AMZN) have tried to take on eBay with little to show for their efforts. Buyers and sellers won`t try new auction sites when eBay gives them the greatest chance of completing a transaction.

Recently however, a large number of meta networks have sprung up. These networks allow both buyers and sellers to go to one place and have access to all of the different auction sites. On the buyer side, sites like AuctionWatch and Bidders Edge enable buyers to search and monitor listings across all the major auction sites. At the same time, on the seller side, sites such as Andale are enabling sellers to post and monitor their listings across multiple sites.

EBay is so concerned about these meta networks that it`s suing some of them, demanding that they pay fees to access eBay`s database of listings. EBay may control database access in the short term, meta networks are gradually removing the auction giant from direct contact with its customers. EBay is turning into one of many databases, decreasing customer loyalty and putting pressure on fees.

Meta networks are pulling apart existing exchanges by using the inherently distributed nature of the Internet.

Indeed programs such as Napster, which is essentially a meta network for MP3 file sharing, demonstrate how powerful meta networks can become. (See last month`s column for more on Napster).

Sobering Exchanges As far as B2B exchanges are concerned, meta networks provide a sobering view of the future. Meta networks connect the individual B2B exchanges together thus undermining the ability of any one exchange to generate substantial network effects. Exchanges will compete on efficiency, service, and price, but never generate incredible returns.

Why is this vision of the future important? Because it highlights the fact that owning a successful exchange is unlikely to produce incredible investment return, even if a given exchange dominates a market.

Just look at what are arguably the two largest and most established exchanges in existence, the New York Stock Exchange and Nasdaq. While together these exchanges dominate the trading of U.S. stocks, as a group they generate less than $1.5 billion a year in revenue. The two exchanges have margins that make them look more like commodity producers than monopolists.

In contrast to the exchanges, brokerages and processing firms make the real money -- $100s of billions in revenue and $10s of billions in profits.

Look for the Three Cs

These firms make money by providing investors with the three C`s: Credit, Clearing, and Custody. All exchanges need the three C`s in order to operate efficiently. And all customers need the three C`s to complete a transaction.

The lesson for B2B companies is that the real money will be made by providing the ancillary services and technologies used by all exchanges. Exchanges won`t matter. At Softbank Venture Capital, this realization has led us to invest in private B2B companies focused on technology and services, such as Perfect.com, Syntra, and Hubstorm, rather than the high-flying industry exchanges.

Investors should approach the various exchange models with skepticism and a focus on those companies providing core software technologies or services.

Sticking to these principles should enable investors to live through the "Great Exchange Mania" and be all the richer for it.




daß das internet transparenz schafft ist klar. gehe ich nun zu ebay oder zu AuctionWatch um etwas zu kaufen ? ich gehe immer noch zu ebay - der markenname machts. der macht im b2b vielleicht weniger aus, doch eine gemeinsamkeit weswegen ich immer zum marktführer gehe, ist die tatsache, daß ich auf bestimmte mechanismen, erfahrungen, kunden und automatisierungsservices vertrauen kann, die mir diese site auf jeden fall bietet. oder ? die ferne zukunft wird es zeigen. Commerce One hat nicht die Umsatzstruktur einer Community wie Fortune City, w-o oder Yahoo, bei der es auf PageImpressions ankommt.

[goodi]

ÜBRIGENS, TREASURY NACH GESTERN PLUS 58% HEUTE

WIEDER 8% IM PLUS!!!!

SIEHE POSTING VOM 01.06.

MFG. GOODI

[goodi]

+10,5%-ENTSCHULDIGUNG.

[gigo1]

zu commerce one:

grüsse
gigo

[tschakawaka]

UND?!?

Hat hier irgend jemand ne Idee, wie Commerce One heute in den U.S.A.
eröffnen wird??? Positiv??? Wohl doch, oder?

Also, berichtet`s was Ihr heute mit Euren Commerce One Aktien vorhabt!!! Nachkaufen, Halten, oder?!?

cu tschaki!!!

p.s. grosse High Tech Analysten meetings in den nächsten Tagen in den U.S.A. - diese werden sicher auch positive Impulse in den Markt bringen...

[Vadders]

Servous tschakawaka

Natürlich, halte ich C1!! Bin sehr positiv diesem Laden gegenüber!
Habe das erste mal bei 79 gekauft,dann bei 66,8 und nun zuletzt bei 42€. Nun habe ich einen Mischkurs von 59.35€ und ich habe vor mit dieser Aktie mehr als 100% zu machen. Würde sogar noch nachkaufen habe aber kein Geld mehr, leider. (C1 = 73% meines Depots)

also sehen wir uns bei, "ich sach´ mal": 120€ ende 2000

Tschau gruss Vadders

[tschakawaka]

Hehe

$$$$$$$$$$$$$

gelle!

cu tschaki

p.s. Ouf, die Spannung steigt...
p.p.s. Ich mag Leute, die von Werten so überzeugt sind, und schliesslich ist C1 kein Penny Stock, sondern einer der führenden B2B Werte!!!

[Vadders]

Es los !!!

ab jetzt wird verdient!!!!

schon über meinem Mischkurs von 59.35€

bin begeistert


vadders

[roje]

die rakete geht los!!! :-))

wer sagt´s denn ?!?

[Geko007]

Hey Leute!
Was jemand näheres über die Maydorn Hotline bei N-TV da steht irgend was über "SAP kauft COMMERCE ONE"!Ist da was wahres dran?
MFG Geko

[jlp2]

Vielleicht ist mit dem reisserischen Titel nur der Einkauf von CMRC-Software-Modulen gemeint.

JLP2

[goodi]

ich idiot habe heute für 3,63 dm/min diese sch...-hotline
abgehört. es scheint,als ob sich maydorn(den ich
bisher schätzte) dem "niveau" eines frick nähert.
im prinzip hat er nur die gerüchte wiederholt, welche im
markt sind. wahrscheinlich wäre auch eine beteligung von
sap an cmrc. mit einer übernahme müßte sich sap beeilen,
weil cmrc täglich teurer wird. das müßte dann in den
nächsten 2 wochen passieren und für cmrc wären bei einer
angekündigten übernahme kurse um die 100 möglich.
sap hätte sich ausweichend geäußert und cmrc überhaupt nicht.
dann hat er noch erwähnt, daß sap probleme mit mysapcom hat
und das bei einer beteiligung cmrc profitieren würde.
schlau,schlau.

mfg.goodi

ps.ich hoffe, daß es zu keiner übernahme kommt,denn ich will
mit cmrc 1000% verdienen und nicht 100.
beteiligung wäre natürlich geil!!

[Topanalyst]

Halte Commerce One ebenfalls auf diesem Niveau für ein absolutes
Schnäppchen.
Was genau ist jetzt mit SAP und Commerce One ?
Maydorn schreibt Übernahme , was aber nur zum anrufen
animieren soll .
Kooperationen welcher Art sind hier geplant ?
Danke

[DimStar]

http://www.eoffering.com/analyst/patrick_mason/pdf/pm_060220…

http://www.radiowallstreet.com/NASApp/RWS/EventPage?ID=22830

[AndyBusch]

Hallo DimStar
Bin jetzt endlich dazugekommen mir die links anzuschauen. Besonders Patrick Mason ist schon eine Klasse für sich.
Hebt sich wohltuend ab von dem sonstigen Analysten-Gesülze.
Bestärkt mich einmal mehr in meiner Auffassung, dass wir ein Perle im Depot haben. Man muss der Perle nur etwas Zeit zum Wachsen geben.
Grüße
Andy

[alonsa]

Vorsicht, liebe C1 Kollegen!

heute erhielt ich per e-mail folgende nachricht (Auszug):

insiderSCORES.com recently processed new insider trading activity at:

CMRC
JAMES & MARILYN SCHLATER TRUST Proposes Sale of of 2528 COMMERCE ONE INC
shares.
The following hyperlink will take you into the transaction page for
COMMERCE ONE INC so you can view more details and put the activity into
historical context.
http://www.insiderscores.com/isbemail.asp?ticker=CMRC&Ttype=…


CMRC
CTS INVESTMENT CO LTD Proposes Sale of of 1986760 COMMERCE ONE INC shares.



CMRC
CHARLES DONCHESS Sells of 75000 COMMERCE ONE INC shares.


CMRC
PETER PERVERE Sells of 50000 COMMERCE ONE INC shares.


CMRC
PETER PERVERE Exercised of 50000 COMMERCE ONE INC shares.

CMRC
CHARLES DONCHESS Exercised of 75000 COMMERCE ONE INC shares.


CMRC
CHARLES DONCHESS Exercised of 84575 COMMERCE ONE INC shares.

Zum großen Teil, ist es nicht schlimm - Aktienoptionen zu realisieren gönne ich jedem erfolreichem Geschäftsmann. Aber so viele plötzlich? Auf einmal? Vergleicht die Vergangenheitsverkäufe...(nach diesem Link ) http://www.insiderscores.com/isbemail.asp?ticker=CMRC&Ttype=…" target="_blank" rel="nofollow ugc noopener">http://www.insiderscores.com/isbemail.asp?ticker=CMRC&Ttype=…
Ich habe noch nicht Gelegenheit gehabt, den direkt nachfolgenden Wirkungsgrad auf den Aktienkurs zu erforschen. Allerdings fürchte ich vor dem institiunellen Verkauf von CTS - fast 2 Mio. Aktien! d.H ca.110.000.000$ ! Vorsicht ist geboten für die nächste Tagen. Kurzfristig kann ein backslide kommen. Langfristig hat diese Nachricht kaum Bedeutung..
Jedem ist überlassen was er tun will...

Weiterhin gute Geschäfte
Alonsa